[Jacob-list] Another color question

[Melody]

Betty--
As far as I can determine, the sheep have not been near any but the jacob rams for 2 years.  They have not been transported nor shown.  These lambs are March lambs, so should be the offspring of the rams and ewes which I now have.  One comment you made--inbreeding--could inbreeding cause this?  My first thought was that somewhere back in the ancestry was a crossbred Jacob, but from what I can find it would have to be several generations back.  It would have to be in the ram's ancestry,  because the lambs came from 3 different ewes.  There is some "line breeding", but haven't asked how much.  Isn't it "line breeding" if it works and "inbreeding" if it doesn't? LOL    Basically there is only one ram and one ewe that are possible "keepers" of the whole bunch.  The rest are not prime specimens, mainly because of severely curling lateral horns that are going to need clipping back to keep them from causing jaw or eye problems.  They are also quite small--not showing any signs of undernourishment, in good condition, but just small bodied.  The rams are about the size of some of my smaller ewes, best I can tell with the rams in full wool and my ewes recently sheared.  
Melody at CritterLand
Redmond OR
  Betty wrote:
  WHere were the mothers when they were bred?  Were they transported with another ram?  AT a sheep show with another ram?  I can't imagine they are purebred; the descriptions sound a lot like lambs I have seen from crossbred.  OR, in one case, the one with the jacob head and eyepatches, like inbred jacobs...But, I'm no expert.  See if you get some better responses from people who've done this longer and have more info.
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Melody 
    To: jacoblist 
    Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 1:33 PM
    Subject: [Jacob-list] Another color question


    I was just given some Jacobs by someone who "just didn't want to mess with them" any longer.  There are 5 ewes, 4 of which have lambs, and 3 yearling rams.  I know the person whose flock the the adult sheep came from, and that person does not, as far as I know, crossbreed her Jacobs.  She has said that the adults gotten from her are purebred Jacobs.  So....then we look at the lambs.   The ram lambs are, to all appearances, Jacob--at least in markings and general conformation, when compared to lambs from my flock.  The 4 ewe lambs are....well, different!!!  Three are solid black except for white blazes down their faces, a white strip down their chins and chests (kinda looks like they are wearing a tux), 4 white socks, and about the last half of their tails is white (tails have been banded, but have not yet dropped off).  The 4th is the same, except her face is white and she has the Jacob eye patches and dark nose.  Looks like they are going to a fancy party!  They also seem to be a bit longer legged in proportion to their bodies, but that could be an illusion due to the coloring.  One of the "odd" ewe lambs is twin to a  "normal" ram lamb.
    OK, here's the question:  Is there any way these could actually be pure Jacob?  Do pure Jacobs ever throw solid black?   These are obviously not going to be put back into the Jacob gene pool as breeders, but my curiosity is killing me.  I trust the person who originally owned the sheep to be an honest breeder, who has had Jacobs for years.  I also know that the person who gave them to me had no other sheep on his property.  Both the ewes and the rams have a bit more black than "standard"--maybe as much as 50-60% in a couple cases.  
    Always something interesting with these sheep!!!!!!
    Melody at CritterLand
    Redmond OR
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://www.pairlist.net/pipermail/jacob-list/attachments/20030506/ab893e18/attachment.htm