[Jacob-list] breeding ewe lambs

Wed Mar 9 12:08:35 EST 2005

Well, if it's Spring, then it's not a nice one.  It's up to about 20, but the wind is horrid, and it was 6 this a.m., following a full day of blizzard condition snow...

Your comments, and Royal's make sense to me, Katrina.  I wouldn't want lambing to last more than 3 weeks, because that's about the limit to the amount of time I want to sit home and spend most of my time out in the shed.  I don't assist, but I love being with t hem.  I don't check nights, but spend lots of time with the pg moms during lambing and spend lots of time holding new lambs and trying to imprint them with human image, so they sell more easily.  

My lambs which  are with their mothers  until Nov. 1, when they get separated out, so the moms can be bred, are generally NOT nursing after June, at mothers' requests.  They are generally around 35 pounds by Nov. 1, I think, born end of March, first two weeks of April. The rams are around 50 pounds by the end of July, running larger than the girls, generally.  And of course, singles are larger than twins.

I don't know how much more prolific my ewes could be than they are: generally about a quarter of them twin as yearlings, first time, the rest singles, and thn about 3/4 of them twin until ...who knows, the oldest one is nine...I do have an eleven year old shetland who is having a bit of trouble this year: I won't breed her again.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Katrina & Dave 
  To: Betty Berlenbach ; jacob-list at jacobsheep.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 8:46 AM
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] breeding ewe lambs

  Hi Betty and all-
  I do think that lines and the type of grass/nutrition the lamb is on, as well as how long the ewe lambs are left on the dam influences this topic.    We have bred Jacobs for 5-6 years... around 30 ewes most of that time.  

  We have always left ewe lambs in with the flock to be breed at around 7 months, as did most of the breeders we bought from.  No problems that I could see. We have had one lamb rejection in that time and this turned out to be a hermaphrodite...a genetic issue.  Also was a triplet.  I do not hold that against the dam.  She was not a first timer. 
   Yearlings always seemed more skiddish than the older ewes and we needed to give them more alone time to bond with their lamb, but it was never a problem. That is to say, if I carried a newborn over to the other barn, the skiddish yearling might run the other direction instead of trying to cut me off like the older ewes would.  So we just left dam/lamb together on pasture a few hours longer until the lamb nursed.  After that, the yearling got over her fears. They usually lambed early April on the tail end of the flock when there was grass around and it was warmer.  It was also nice to have lambing spread out a bit.  They almost always had one lamb and while sometimes puzzled by the little critter, never failed to accept them.  (That said, I know one of our buyers had a yearling from us that rejected one of a set of twins the first year).  I should go back and check how many yearlings lambed at our place and details on them.  

  However, we do leave the ewe lambs on the dams for most of the summer and our pastures had top-notch grasses, so most of the ewe lambs were well grown by fall.  That probably makes a difference when talking about size. I have seen some flocks that don't have the luxury of top notch pastures and lambs were much smaller...that might make me think twice, I guess.   I think it is fine practice to not breed ewe lambs, if that works well for your system.  But for us, leaving the flock together was always the easiest and seemed to work well.  The biggest reason I could validate not breeding ewe lambs is a back-up in registration paperwork.  That is, the next generation comes around so fast that you don't have time to evaluate the ewe and be sure you want to keep her in the flock.  But that is only a problem with the larger flocks, I would think?  

  Dave covered a conference that made a case for genetics being a bigger issue in adult size than nutrition in milk heifers...if nutrition was added later, the heifers caught up.  Not sure if that applies to sheep or not.

  Just some thoughts and our experience.  
  Is it spring yet????  *grin*
  Katrina Lefever

  ___________________________

Katrina & Dave Oberholtzer Lefever
  Pigeon Hills Place
  7890 Gnatstown Rd
  Hanover, PA 17331
  (717) 637-6670
  davekat at copper.net
  http://chicoryjacobs.com

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Betty Berlenbach 
    To: jacob-list at jacobsheep.com 
    Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2005 6:52 AM
    Subject: [Jacob-list] breeding ewe lambs

    I don't breed ewe lambs because I am convinced that breeding anything before their frames are  fully developed is not a good thing.  Also, it seems that nine out of ten times that people on the list talk about problems, they are with ewe lambs having babies...a thirteen year old can have a baby, but it really isn't the best course of action for her.  I don't breed ewe lambs, don't have problems lambing (two interventions in 10 years) and haven't lost a lamb in 8 years.  That, to me, is the kind of track record that suggests that maybe breeding ewe lambs, at least with this flock and in this place, is not a good idea.  I have only had one mother reject a lamb, and she was 14 and had only one working teat.  She wanted both boys with her, but apparently decided she only had enough milk to feed one, so I fed the other who stayed with her, but she nudged him to me for the bottle.  That was six years ago.

    Is there anyone out there who breeds ewe lambs who has had only one rejection in ten years and hasn't lost a lamb in 8 years?  If so, I will consider my evidence as not related to ewe lambs, but just some other practices or the particular lines I have.

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