[Jacob-list] lilac

[Carl Fosbrink]

I agree Lasell's ewe's color is totally different colors than black or lilac. It is something I have never seen in any of several lilacs I have had born here over the years. I think it has to be something in the genes these sheep have that is not present in my sheeps' genes or is so recessive that it hasn't shown up.


From: Linda 
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2012 7:25 PM
To: spotted_sheep at bluefrog.com 
Cc: Carl Fosbrink ; jacob-list at jacobsheep.com 
Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] lilac


My different shaded ewe is a great great granddaughter of PMA Clinton. But my RubyBelle was a granddaughter of Clinton and I've had alot of lilacs descended from her that were uniform in color. 
I've also seen blacks with a difference in shading, so don't think it's something that is specific to lilacs. 
Lasell's ewe is something else. The colors certainly do look like completely different colors rather than variations of the same color.
Linda

On 5/3/2012 12:39 PM, spotted_sheep at bluefrog.com wrote: 
  Well, Harley and Ivory are daughter/mother. The only connection for B'Elana and Ivory/Harley is P.M.A. Clinton, who appears 8 generations back on B'Elana's twice, and once 9 generations back a third time. In Ivory's he shows up 6 generations back (7 for Harley). Not very likely related to the color, but I guess it is possible... I suppose there could be others farther back, but that is the only one that stuck out to me. 
  Harley hasn't been registered yet (haven't had the time or cash to do it), that's why you can't find her. Her sire is a ram out of Fibre Folds Chortle and Unzicker Ashton. Chortle carries lilac, but I don't think that has anything to do with this, as Ivory (Harley's mother) throws this calico pattern no matter what ram she is bred to.


  Marie
  Spot Hollow Farm



  --- fourhornfarm at frontier.com wrote:

  From: "Carl Fosbrink" <fourhornfarm at frontier.com>
  To: <spotted_sheep at bluefrog.com>, "Shannon Phifer" <kenleighacres at yahoo.com>
  Cc: <patchworkfibers at windstream.net>, <justinedixon at aol.com>, <jacob-list at jacobsheep.com>
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] lilac
  Date: Thu, 3 May 2012 12:01:55 -0400


  Do Harley, B'Elana and  Ivory have any common ancestors? 


  From: spotted_sheep at bluefrog.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2012 8:56 PM
  To: Shannon Phifer 
  Cc: patchworkfibers at windstream.net ; justinedixon at aol.com ; jacob-list at jacobsheep.com ; fourhornfarm at frontier.com 
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] lilac


  I have had almost one lamb every lambing that has been black, with at least one lilac patch on it. I have two adult ewes in my flock with this (Spot Hollow Harley and Spot Hollow B'Elana), and one adult ewe who has thrown at least one lamb a year with this spotting pattern (Painted Rock Ivory), but does not show it herself. 
  Ivory's ewe lamb this year is very light, but she has two lilac spots that seem to "over lap" her black - one on her neck and one on her front leg. Harley is Ivory's lamb from several years ago and she has a fairly good sized lilac spot on her side. B'Elana has one on the back of her neck, she was the first I had seen with this. Most of the time they are small spots, about the size of a quarter. I don't think this means they carry lilac, but I haven't gotten my hands on a good lilac ram to put to them to see, but they haven't thrown any lilacs when bred to carriers.
  Maybe it is something like the gene for calico in cats? Come to think of it, I have never seen it in rams ; )


  Marie
  Spot Hollow Farm


  --- kenleighacres at yahoo.com wrote:

  From: Shannon Phifer <kenleighacres at yahoo.com>
  To: Linda <patchworkfibers at windstream.net>, "justinedixon at aol.com" <justinedixon at aol.com>
  Cc: "jacob-list at jacobsheep.com" <jacob-list at jacobsheep.com>, "fourhornfarm at frontier.com" <fourhornfarm at frontier.com>
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] lilac
  Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 17:00:29 -0700 (PDT)


  I believe Karen Lobb, had a black ewe with tawny spot(s) much like Lasell's, a few years ago.  I can't remember his exact response, but Gary Anderson responded saying that it had something to do with the expression of color in those certain areas of the body.  Not really color related, just color placement.  Hopefully Gary reads this and can explain it again.  
  I have a couple lilac ewes much like what Linda described - they have darker 'lilac' spots within their spots.  

  Shannon Phifer
  Kenleigh Acres Farm
  www.kenleigh-acres.com




  From: Linda <patchworkfibers at windstream.net>
  To: justinedixon at aol.com 
  Cc: jacob-list at jacobsheep.com; fourhornfarm at frontier.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 2:47 PM
  Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] lilac



  I haven't seen one with actual black and lilac spots on the same animal, but I do have a lilac with a few darker chocolate spots among the lighter spots. She's a two year old and the difference may have been more obvious at her first shearing. She's one I sold as a lamb and bought back, so I missed the first shearing. As a lamb, her color was even. On Quinn, it seems to be a case of uneven fading, rather than different colors, as the spots are varying shades of brown.
  Lasell had a really interesting one with very distinct color differences that were apparent at birth. It should be in the archives or maybe Lasell will share it again.
  I don't have any idea what causes the uneven random color. I will be interested in hearing what others have to say about it.
  There is a type of spotting with different colors that can happen when you have a spotted agouti/shaded patterned animal. In that case, the dark/light areas correspond to the agouti placements in a solid animals. You wouldn't see this in Jacobs, but I've seen it in crossbreds and it's common in spotted rabbits. Obviously not what you are seeing in your lamb.

  Linda

  On 5/1/2012 9:19 PM, justinedixon at aol.com wrote: 
    Carl, Linda, Peg et al. 


    I was very interested reading your comments on lilacs and colour variation.  I have a lilac yearling that seems to have black spots also. See attached photo, is this common?


    Thanks
    Stuart
    www.byeburnfarm.com  

    Patchwork Farm Jacob Sheep 

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