[Jacob-list] Grain'-n-grazin'

Sat Nov 24 17:23:30 EST 2001

Katrina and all,
Stockpiling is a way of extending the grazing season. In central Ny state we usually stop grazing a designated pasture/acerage about mid-July. Depending on the types of grasses you have, most of them won't seed out during the slower growth of summer/fall. We are usually able to graze this stockpiled forage during December.  As long as the snow isn't too deep or icy they can get to the grass.  Usually this grass tests very high in protein.  However, we have stockpiled too early which results in crud grass.  And then of course there are dry summers like the past one when we weren't able to stockpile much because we needed the grass. 

I agree that land is expensive.  The good news at least in my neck of the woods is that there are quite a few large pieces of farm land that are idle, fallow, turning to brush. For me it is cheaper to lease pasture from neighbors, and invest in more portable fencing and chargers, than to buy hay and grain.  If you have an ag exemption on your taxes you can pass this on to the neighbors from whom you lease land. Some city folks that buy land in the country are happy to have someone keep their fields clear.

It seems like the forage would affect the flavor of the meat.  We raise pastured pig and I was told that in either Italy or Spain that they raise pigs on acorns and the reults are delicious.  I know that the flavor of chickens can be affected by fishmeal in the feed.  Perhaps this is less of a factor with ruminants?  Garlic and mint sound wonderful for lamb!

Pam Millar
ZuZu's Petals Farm
    -----Original Message-----
    From: dave & katrina <oberlef at desupernet.net>
    To: Jacoblist <jacob-list at jacobsheep.com>
    Date: Friday, November 23, 2001 2:06 PM
    Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] Grain'-n-grazin'

    Hi Pam-
    You mentioned stock-piling to carry the flock thru Dec...What exactly is the meaning of the term?  We have our girls back in a pasture that hasn't been grazed this year yet (bush-hogged once), looks like it might last until mid Dec or so.  Is this what you are referring to, or is it another technique?  Are there ways to do it that protein can be optimized?

    Thanks for the recap of your program...I really enjoy hearing how other people's programs are run.  You know, in many old shepherding books I read that the best tonic for new mothers is fresh green grass.  Seems to help produce milk and recondition their uterus.  I think some of the weeds/herbs growing wild also have some health affects.  

    One more thought.  I was out replenishing the minerals this morning and added powdered garlic like usual....I know garlic changes the taste of milk in dairy cows, could it affect the taste of meat?  How is that for niche marketing...already seasoned lamb meat!  *smile*  
    Katrina, Chicory Lane
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Jim Millar 
        To: Grose ; Jacoblist 
        Sent: Friday, November 23, 2001 10:14 AM
        Subject: Re: [Jacob-list] Fw: Grain'-n-grazin'

        Neal and all,

        You all have said everything I might have said much more eloquently than I could have. One futher thing to consider...I do agree that there may be on first glance more management involved with rotational grazing style, vs feeding grain in a more confined setting.  
        Consider though, when making the comparison, that someone somewhere drove around on a tractor seeding, then spraying then spraying again then harvesting that grain.  In many cases that grain was packaged and loaded on the back of a truck and hauled to your local feed store.  Don't overlook the considerable labor involved there.
        We usually have stockpiled grass (if done right this can test very high protein) to get us through to the end of December.  I use this as my "flush".  We breed around Christmas.  I give a little grain towards Feb March in mid gestation.  They are usually on grass slowly by mid April, lamb in mid May.  I avoid needing grain during lambing and lactation.  It is amazing how early the lambs start grazing when they are born on  the pasture..  
        I have found that the taste of the lamb and beef raised on grass is very different than the taste from grain fed animals.  In the lamb there is less fat which to me sometimes gives that very strong flavor (maybe some like it?). The lamb is milder.  Grassfed beef has a much more robust flavor.  The grassfed lamb has always been very tender, but the grassfed beef really needs to hang for a couple weeks becasue without the fat it can have a tough texture.
        I try really hard to make my enterprise enjoyable and profitable.  It's fun to move animals through green pastures.  It is also much cheaper (for me) to not buy grain.  And I have customers find me becasue I don't feed grain.  And, they are willing to pay more for grassfed meats.

        ps extension agents will always tell you that you need to feed grain.  Consider who pays their salaries and writes the "booklets" Someone has to pay for all  those tractors, and seeders and combines.

        Hope you all had a wonderful Thanksgiving,
        Pam Millar
        ZuZu's Petals Farm

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Grose <NLGrose at Yadtel.net>
            To: Jacoblist <jacob-list at jacobsheep.com>
            Date: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 2:55 PM
            Subject: [Jacob-list] Fw: Grain'-n-grazin'

            ----- Original Message ----- 
            From: Grose 
            To: Jacoblist 
            Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 7:10 AM
            Subject: Grain'-n-grazin'

            OK, Betty, I'll probably get in trouble on this one, but here goes:
            1] We feed grain because it is cheaper than forage.
            2] Good grazing is very expensive in terms of management inputs.
            3] Feeding perfectly good alfalfa to a bunch of blankety-blank sheep is a waste of resources.
                                       [ack! ack! Off with 'is head!]
            On the other hand:
            4] There is little doubt in my mind that grazing good quality pasture is beneficial to the health of the animal.
            5] Forage consumption and grazing in particular tends to increase the amount of omega-3 fatty acids, conjugated linoleaic[sp?] acid, and beta carotene in the fat deposits and milk fat of ruminants. This is a good thing.

            Let's back up and punt. 
            On adult sheep [and cows] on maintenance diets, almost all of the nutrients the animal eats winds up as ammonia and proprionic acid. The proprionic acid is absorbed directly through the rumen and used as an energy source, converted to glucose, glycogen etc. The ammonia grows bacteria that pass on to the other stomachs and are digested for protein. The creed in ruminant nutrition is to "feed the rumen[bacteria]." and let the rumen feed the sheep or the cow.

            We feed the sheep X pounds of protein and Y pounds of energy [expressed as TDN or total digestible nutrients] each day, dependant on body weight, growth requirements, lactation requirements and so on. Feed consumption varies directly according to size, so a maintenance diet [dry cows and non-lactating ewes and guys watching football] need 11-12% crude protein and 62-66% TDN. High producing cows, ewes feeding twins, and fast growing young lambs need 16-18% protein and 74-76% TDN. This is equivalent to a person running a marathon...every day. 

            The cheapest source of protein is soybean oil meal. The cheapest source of energy is corn. If top quality alfalfa hay is priced according to soybean meal and corn, the cost is twice its value as a feedstuff. Here in the South, alfalfa has significantly less energy value than it does in the North.

             For lactating ewes, alfalfa hay has to be supplemented with corn to provide adequate energy for a complete ration. Corn silage is high in energy value and needs to be supplemented with soybean or cottonseed meal to provide a complete ration.  Medium quality hay needs a grain ration that is some of each, generally 25% SOM and 75% corn [a 16% grain ration].

            In maintenance diets, on the other hand, good alfalfa oversupplies protein and corn silage oversupplies energy. Neither is a "good" ration component for those that don't need it.

             When grazing, on the other hand, careful management is required to maintain the forage in a vegetative state to provide energy values of 66-70% TDN which will support lactation or active growth of lambs. Good flavor and tenderness of lamb has little to do with grain feeding and everything to do with sustaining fast, consistent growth rates. This probably applies to fleece growth as well. Worms and spells of poor nutrition lower quality. Grass that is grazed in a more mature state has drastically reduced energy and protein levels and is not likely to support growth without supplemental grain. As an alternative, we leave ewe lambs with their dams, where they can continue to nurse for several months. 

            The idea of grazing pastures in rotation with horses is a good one. Grasses, sheep and internal parasites all evolved together into a 3 week or so cycle. This means that a 3 week rotational grazing plan places the sheep back into a pasture that is optimal for reinfestation with worms. Breaking this cycle with horses [which have different parasites] breaks this cycle. The same thing can be accomplished by harvesting hay from these paddocks in-between grazing cycles.

            The key to recovering the increased costs that come from this higher management is niche marketing. 

            Neal Grose

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